Working Group

#734 Working Group: ATES systems

Jaap Balvers Mon 16 Sep 2019

Hi all,

We are planning to setup a basis for tagging ATES systems: aquifer thermal energy storage. I'm looking for other interested community members to contribute in a Working Group.

This type of system is quite common in The Netherlands and surrounding countries. Typically, these are "open" systems with at least one "hot" and one "cold" groundwater source. Wikipedia link

First topics to tackle would be:

  • scoping: type of systems to cover: closed loop systems and/or open well systems
  • scoping: inlcude/exclude the heatPump equip
  • scoping: include/exclude "regeneration" equip (e.g. water to air condenser, surface water, ..)
  • who will champion this WG

There are some topics this WG probably will touch and we'll need some haystack expert help:

  1. heat exchangers, these are principal components and there is a need to accurately define temperatures and flow on both sides of one or more heatExchanger equips
  2. overall setup: defining a single high-level ates equip or subdividing in separate equips (heatExchanger, energy meter, well pump, etc.)
  3. compliancy with Haystack 4.0 - do we need to think about tagging differently with haystack 4.0 in mind?

At the moment, we are working on a starting document together with another company in NL. We are hoping to share this in the coming weeks. Anybody interested in joining: feel free!

Matthew Giannini Tue 24 Sep 2019

HI Jaap - thanks for taking the lead on this working group. I'm going to promote this topic to WG status and you can take it from there.

Ronald Breijer Tue 24 Sep 2019

I agree with Jaap that we need tagging for ATES systems so I would like to join in as well.

Patrick Albers Thu 3 Oct 2019

Jaap, Great idea, we would like to contribute to this WG.

Coen Hoogervorst Mon 7 Oct 2019

Hi Jaap,

As we also are collecting a lot of data from ATES systems I would also like to contribute to this WG.

Jaap Balvers Thu 10 Oct 2019

Hi Ronald, Patrick and Coen,

Great to have you join our WG!

I'll contact you offline to set things up and get started.

  • Jaap

Siem Opschoor Mon 21 Oct 2019

Hi Jaap and other members,

DWA are collecting data from ATES systems for 20 years. We have created our own tagging model, but we miss the integration with the BMS systems.

I am also the founder of Monavisa/Simaxx but now I have returned to DWA where we are working on artificial intelligence and the next step of analyzing energy systems.

I think it is good to develop a widely supported model that can help data integration one step ahead

Jaap Balvers Tue 22 Oct 2019

Thanks for joining Siem, and Leo and Bas also. I've sent you an invite to contribute offline. When we have a first draft, we'll upload it here on the forum for review.

Jaap Balvers Mon 25 Nov 2019

An update from this WG: we have exchanged some ideas offline and have scheduled a meeting soon to discuss the proposal. We plan to submit a draft for review on the forums mid-December.

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